Video Blog #21
by Chris Taylor on Jul.02, 2010, under Design, Videos
Formation Prototyping, more epic high-fives, and sweet, sweet revenge. Send us your Comments
49 Comments for this entry
Leave a Reply
©2010 Gas Powered Games Corp. All Rights Reserved. Gas Powered Games and
Chris Taylor's Kings and Castles are the exclusive trademarks of Gas Powered Games Corp. All
other trademarks and copyrights are the properties of their respective owners.
July 2nd, 2010 on 3:33 pm
Awesome formations. So I guess archers/legendaries would fill in the middle of the circle formation?
July 2nd, 2010 on 4:07 pm
Yay, my comment got used again
it’s really great the way you guys are interacting with the community, I feel so special
The formations look cool but I notice a distinct lack of wedge -.- I assume this is because they are infantry units and not charging cavalry.
July 2nd, 2010 on 4:17 pm
Very nice formations.
Will it be possible to custom these formations, to chose which unit is put in these formations?
July 2nd, 2010 on 4:20 pm
Is it me or does it seem really dark in that office? If so, then that is awesome. I’ve always preferred doing 3D modeling in the dark.
July 2nd, 2010 on 4:32 pm
Hey chris, love the blog, the game looks awesome.
Im wondering what your guys plans are for multiplayer? Will it be competitive and tactical like supreme commander, and do you have any other idea’s or plans for it?
July 2nd, 2010 on 5:12 pm
I can’t help myself but the formations don’t look good. They fit to mechanic units but not to human formations. People watching historic war movies will agree. In reality you have tighter formations. You have long battle lines and not squares. Soldiers walk shoulder to shoulder on a close battle line. Would be awesome if you guys could tweak this a lil more to make it look realistic.
July 2nd, 2010 on 6:03 pm
Awesome Formations, annoyingness (jeez Chris), and sweet-ass high five!
July 2nd, 2010 on 11:09 pm
Silly Chris! Kids don’t watch these videos on their own accord: their dad’s obviously a hardcore 33 year old gamer!
P.S very nice formations – I hope they are as practical as they are aesthetically pleasing!
July 2nd, 2010 on 11:13 pm
Are the formations going to provide certain buffs like your ‘morale’ system? like forming square gives 10% bonus vs cav etc.?
July 2nd, 2010 on 11:30 pm
I like how always 2 guys are a bit late in the formation, makes it realistic =)
You could have one of the legendaries use the “It’s my lunch” line
July 2nd, 2010 on 11:46 pm
I really enjoy watching your video blog, not only because I’m interested in the game but also because it tends to be very funny. But there’s one third thing I’m missing the last episodes: Explanations!
Could you go more into the detail in future blogs? I would be glad to recieve some insight to the mechanics of stuff like your formation system. Even if this insight remains shallow, 30 seconds of someone explaining transports some kind of idea how it works. Pathfinding! Local and global AI! Game engine interna!
July 3rd, 2010 on 12:52 am
Hey Chris,
awesome video, as always.
Will you use in Kings & Castles a similar zooming system as in Supreme Commander ? Because that went really well for big battles.
The formations also got me thinking, how many singular men make one unit ? Is the Group size you showed 1 unit ? Or is it every man for himself ?
If the unit size is bigger, what would be really great to see would be if the men in one unit would interact a bit, at least when they break formation…maybe they could hide behind each other when confronted with a swarm of arrows.
July 3rd, 2010 on 12:57 am
How well are infantry units going to be able to hold their formation in melee combat? Are formations going to be able to provide a reliable way to hold off enemy troops from something squishier like siege equipment or archers, or will they end up being like Supcom 2 formations; a nice idea, but fairly useless in competitive gameplay.
—————————————————-
“You could have one of the legendaries use the “It’s my lunch” line” – Ivan
You absolutely HAVE to do this!
July 3rd, 2010 on 1:20 am
Superb job with the formations. I hope in the future there will be a sweet diplomatic system in game, between king and king. Like you could send an emissary/diplomat to the other king to start negotiations.
I love how negotiations could come handy, getting two of your enemies attacking each other.. etc.
July 3rd, 2010 on 1:54 am
I’ve watched all the videoblogs, and with each one I watched I got more convinced of NOT buying this game UNLESS there is a model or a character in the story mode modeled after Chris Taylor and of course voiced by Chris Taylor… IT IS VITAL!!!
also a good suggestion would be that the kings horse could deal tons of damage by biting people…
July 3rd, 2010 on 3:11 am
The formation system looks great, I’m just curious about how it will hold up during combat & large army moves.
A lot of games have had rad formation systems but they all ultimately buckled once the units go into combat, or when individual behaviors trumped group behaviors.
I really hope that once a group of units are put into a formation, they behave as a group. For example if an enemy unit comes within range of 5 units in a 50 unit formation, the entire formation should react and not just the 5 units. That’s sort of thing has driven me nuts in previous games.
I’m also curious how the formations will re-form when moving through choke-points and obstacles like bridges, trees, wreckage and such. It would be really cool to have a video showing formations moving through obstructions and stuff
July 3rd, 2010 on 7:01 am
Hey Chris, how old are you? 0_o
July 3rd, 2010 on 7:51 am
Blast I should of asked if the Beta will be on Xbox and/or PC! Grr!
July 3rd, 2010 on 12:59 pm
Will the troops bee bought in smal groups like 9 or 10 soldiers per groip or will they be bought one unit at a time? i would also like to se that you would be able to build roads and your own bridges and that the soldiers mabey moves a little faster on them.and as a last thing woden’t it be cool if your soldiers were able to walk and fight on walls and gates??
July 3rd, 2010 on 2:26 pm
Nice formations indeed
But something tickles me a little about it : when the units start moving, they all depart at the exact same time, like a big block, witch doesn’t… well… “feels” as über-awesome as it should !
Is their a way to add a random delay (like 0 to 0.2 sec) to the start time ?
July 3rd, 2010 on 6:43 pm
First i would like to say that, Chris i would love to work with you one day, but i just a programming student by now, so i’ll have to wait =P.
about the game, i know you are just starting it, but is you and your team thinking about adding a good variety of combat animations? Because most of the rts games have like one to three different animations in a single unit, and it really look good when some games “break the rules” as the units look a lot more as fighting in a real combat, or at least it gets more exciting to watch.
(A good example of that would be Battle Realms, it had lame, square graphics, but every units had like 5 animations, and that’s back in 2001!! Because of that even with the lame graphics it was really fun to watch the units crushing each other.)
July 3rd, 2010 on 8:19 pm
Chris,
Seeing this game is cut from the SC Engine (why re-invent the wheel), will the movement speed of armies be slowed down to give the feel grandeur to the maps?
I assume the game maps will be the scale of SC2 and not the epic ones of SC1.
July 4th, 2010 on 12:58 am
Really nice formations stuff indeed ! as usually, I hope all this great stuff will be one day included in Supcom 2 or another sequel. I have the feeling that being yourself the Editor of the game gives you, at last, this huge degree of magnitude to express all your team creativity. I have noticed that all people in GPG office look like happy which makes me think it must be very cool to work at GPG
Thanks again for this nice video blog Chris.
July 4th, 2010 on 4:46 am
Hey devs… and Chris!
By the look of it, there will be loads of units moving around so have you thought about having some kind of a variety for each of them? Instead of making all 50-100 footmen look exactly the same, you could implement a system that would issue units of the same kind with a different gear.
For example, you could design 5-10 slightly varied (otherwise they would be too different and players couldn’t easily decide whether they’re the same units or not) helmets/gloves/armor and these would be distributed randomly and in random colors among the same units.
This would also add a little bit of reality and uniqueness (although I’ve seen this system in Fantasy Wars) to your game.
July 4th, 2010 on 5:21 am
Warning: Really Long Post Down Here, sorry about that. xP.
So Chris looking at the game untill now, and maybe is just because it’s in the pre-production, but it looks like it will be like SupComm2, which means litle variety of units, with a more easier to learn gameplay, i hope you add more types of units and building, because SC2 just had too feel for me, and is pretty common that medieval themed games don’t have that much variety, but thinking you’re the one who made Total Annihilation Kingdoms, i guess i don’t need to worry about that
.
And There was something that would be really nice to see in this game, what you think about:
1. making possible to the military units to entrench,
2.making defensive formations that will likely give then a boost of defense or attack
3.Making Garrisons In The Buildings, that will show the units in some good spots to fire the enemy outside, and also in the vehicles, imagine if that big Zeppelin had some archers inside to make it more defendable against air units?
4.Your Units should be capable of leveling up don’t you think? if that’s to be added in the game, would be nice if there’s a way of making a entire group of units to share experience or not, also some tech tree upgrades for more exp or for “forced lvl up” would be nice.
5.as the units evolve. it would be cool to see then make new moves, a soldier would likely make new combo moves and peharps would learn to use magic, and it wouldn’t be manually activated, just a new automatic combo, making the unit act more independtly.
6.as The name of this game is King and Castles, i really hope to see units that will be able to go up the walls and fight from there, and people fighting from the towers of the Castle would be totally awesome!!
7.i know this last one is ambitious but, what about units fighting inside the castle? in place of just attacking the walls with swords slashes untill it cumbles down, it would be good to see the less as something you have to protect from getting hit at all costs, and more as the last line of defense where your garrisoned units and those from the enemy will fight, like a real Keep of a real Castle.
July 4th, 2010 on 5:22 am
Loving what i see so far. Where StarCraft 2 obviously is the game everyone is looking forward to, this game looks so much more appealing to me.
I was wondering if this game has base building in any form though? I would love to hear something about base/unit production, as that is an extremely important part of the game.
Keep up the good work!
July 4th, 2010 on 12:44 pm
“Korsan82
July 2nd, 2010 on 5:12 pm
In reality you have tighter formations. Soldiers walk shoulder to shoulder on a close battle line. Would be awesome if you guys could tweak this a lil more to make it look realistic. ”
I also hope they will fix a “spacing”. Tight formations of spearmens is Must have. Just guess that formation in video is presenting Mathematic task “Make formation” which was done well.
Looking forward
July 5th, 2010 on 6:52 am
Chris, I’m scared. Why do you kill blondes? Some of us are not bad:)
And yeah, formations look like a dream of crazy general. But Suvorov was a little bit crazy I’m sure.. and he was a true winner!
Good luck, show us more!
July 5th, 2010 on 7:09 am
I gotta say, the formations are looking great. Hopefully having units in different formations during attack will actually make some sort of noticeable, tactical difference, otherwise they just end up being eye candy.
I too, say that you need to put the “It’s my lunch!” line somewhere in the game.
July 5th, 2010 on 8:40 am
I like the work on formations and I hope that various types of military classes move to the proper roles. Example if you have a while group selected and move to lines that archers will be in the back of the formation, pike men will be up front and so on. One thing that always annoyed me about some RTS games is the clumping of units and resulted in death. Awesome preview of the progress can’t wait for more.
July 6th, 2010 on 7:41 am
Hi,
while your formation stuff really looks cool, it lacks a little bit of “good feeling” when the soldiers run around; especially when they start running.
I’ve been working on the base AI stuff of “Sacred 2″ and I tried to spread the start of running of the soldiers/units within 500ms or so. This really gives the groups and formations a good feeling when they start to run, run around and go into their formation position at the target position. The formation is important when the units reach their target or when they stand still, but a little bit less when they go from A to B.
Have fun
July 6th, 2010 on 7:50 am
I really like your formation system, but there’s one thing I don’t like about it. Units are standing in a row too perfectly. Some of the units have to be standing a bit in front, to the left or to the right, to make it feel more realistic.
July 6th, 2010 on 8:05 am
Nice work on the formations! I like.
Please don’t make the game so simple and dumbed down like Supcom2.
July 6th, 2010 on 8:43 am
The game looks great so far, especially with the massive size of the batallions. I was wondering about the color schemes in the game though… will they be dictated by race or can the player choose from a set number of colors? Also, will there be a custom color scheme option like Dawn of War?
July 6th, 2010 on 5:46 pm
@Korsan82
For fighting purposes it doesn’t make sense to have knights with longswords quite “shoulder to shoulder”. They get too close and they have no room to swing a sword. Now, if this game is to have, say, pikemen, those sorts of soldiers could fight from a much tighter formation, but for the longsword wielding knights we’ve been seeing, the spacing of the soldiers is fine.
July 6th, 2010 on 8:36 pm
Oh Chris…. not nice to choke out ladies! I guess you’ve lost that lovin feelin.
July 6th, 2010 on 10:52 pm
It looks nice so far, but there’s one thing about the formations I’d like to ask. All the soldiers stand in the exactly same way than the others which makes them look more like robots. It would be nice if there was a little variation with the position and the way they stand, so it’d look more like a group of humans. Also, the formation could break a little when the soldiers move so it wouldn’t just look like a moving rectangle.
However, the different formations look very nice! I hope they also have some effect in the game!
July 7th, 2010 on 7:40 am
CHRIS!!! watch out i think someone will try and steal all your nuts from the nut bar! *whispers* i think it maybe the funny chick and beat you up…oh and she owns the horse that bit you…oh and a smiley face formation would be co0l…or maybe if you got a really big army you could do *the bird*
formation…any way i thought i would give you a heads up…and remember with great nuts comes great responsibility!
July 7th, 2010 on 7:52 am
oh and to all the people that keep saying don’t dumb it down like Supcom2 …..give me a break ok so it wasn’t as in depth as Supcom or total annihilation but Supcom2 was a multi-platform game which means it had to be played on a X-Box controller …but its still a very good game its good for when you only have 30mins and want a quick game and with the overhead A.I. it makes it harder and if you want it to be more in depth try play more the one A.I. on easy…..nubs
July 8th, 2010 on 12:12 am
+++ WE WANT A MAP EDITOR FOR SUPREME COMMANDER 2! PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE – - – WE NEED IT! Multiplayer goes empty +++
July 8th, 2010 on 12:21 am
Hi,I like where this project is going but the mega creatures seem to be again,extremely huge.
When it was about robots it felt ok when you had huge robots alongside really small ones but when it comes to a fantasy setting it looks weird having a boar the size of a pyramid.
That boar should have been like 30% of size IMO,any bigger and it really breaks immersion.
It’s cool to see big units along side small ones but when the difference is too big it leans towards the comical and breaks immersion.
If you are gonna use mythical creatures like dragons may i suggest a Hydra?Hydras are really cool.
July 8th, 2010 on 12:26 am
Me again.
I’d like to suggest a formation placing mechanism.
Basically you select a group of units say 100 knights and than draw with a big “paintbrush” the area you’d want them to spread on,this means more accurate and strategic control of unit placement,especially when they are in big numbers.
Having different fixed formations is very limiting and in the RTS that use it feels clumsy.
July 8th, 2010 on 2:10 am
formation animations looked v nice. attention to detail like that is always a winner.
July 8th, 2010 on 6:08 am
I LIKE BIG UNITS! it makes you feel more powerful
July 8th, 2010 on 9:00 am
PLEASE! Do not what ever you do, DO NOT make health bars visible especially with small units. I hate those moments in some RTS’s (Supcom 2 was one) when a would be Epic moment is ruined by masses the of health bars that paint the screen.
Anyway I love the formations (A bit closer together maybe) and make sure the dragon has more close combat moves and animations- I felt that at the end of the trailer (it was awesome) the dragon should have ripped at least one balloon apart with it’s claws and teeth.
P.S I know you’re still building up the basics these are just some ideas!
P.P.S I love what I’ve seen so far, keep it up!
July 8th, 2010 on 9:17 pm
What do you look for when hiring for your team? Can I show you my game?
Earlier you were deciding on what would be the third faction, and immediately switch to a shot of a chicken. That would be cool, but here’s another idea: Use the axes of the traditional Dungeons and Dragons alignment chart. Good and evil are on one axis, and law and chaos are on the other. And they’re orthogonal, so it’s completely possible for law to be fighting against good and so on.
One of the issues addressed in Supreme Commander 2 was faction diversity. While SupCom 2 did better than SupCom 1, I still would like to see more of a push in this direction. Even in SupCom 2, I felt that I could sit down with any race and play them basically the same way as any other. I would prefer that the factions be even more distinct, even to the extreme of forcing me to learn each one separately.
Along the same lines, in SupCom 2, I know you worked on visual distinctiveness of the units, but I really didn’t feel it. Admittedly, they looked distinct up close, but you don’t spend a lot of time at that zoom level in a game like SupCom. And at high zoom levels you only see the icons. But there is an awkward middle zoom level where SupCom 2 made it hard to distinguish units which is really important to get right. I’d like to see that in Kings and Castles.
Speaking of which, the additions to the zoomed-out strategic mode in SupCom 2 were awesome. Do more with that.
I’m looking forward to the game
July 9th, 2010 on 2:15 pm
i want to play this game! looks realy awesome. i played all your games so far and i loved them! keep going
October 13th, 2010 on 11:59 pm
hi blogger, magnificent article.. pls continue this awesome work..
March 1st, 2011 on 2:21 am
Very effectively written information. It is going to be invaluable to anyone who usess it, including myself. Sustain the nice work – for positive i will take a look at extra posts.